Doppelganger soul discussion.

Mithos wrote:I've personally always thought of a Milletian's body as an shell that quickly decays when empty.
It's not like a Milletian's body is the same as an Erinn-Born's. Everything about them is sturdier and more durable.

I don't disagree, but doesn't that sound funny? XD

I think it's always been established that the Milletian soul was different than those born in Erinn. It's easier to remove from the body, but it's also a lot harder to catch. The soul stream is a very powerful force so it would quickly suck up the soul unless contained properly(Soul crystal). In the case of Bushin(Doppelganger.... they need to make it dopple>_>) it's only a human holding the soul, therefor the soulstream would be able to quickly confiscate it.
That being said, Aura's and Mithos' theory stand good even allowing it to be soul power.

In Aura's case we can establish how long can the person hold the Milletian soul.
If we decide we can't, we basically have Mithos'.

So far I am good with both, leaning toward's Mithos.

As the case for Kenelm: I like this one a lot, but I feel it's dumbing down the school/taking away it's worth. Which isn't a bad thing, and totally valid suggestion.

I have brought multiple reasons for why it would work, and I can get even more detailed, and bring even synonymous situations based on real world facts (brain activity after death, body functions still working, etc.) which support this suggestion, and even bring metaphysical reasons which are lore-compatible (Erg was just one bit beginning).

I am not exactly sure how Real-Life details will help you prove anything. Yes, I understand that the body does have energy after death(if that is where you are going).

But absorbing 'Erg', is not the way to do it. Erg is everything in the world, absorbing the 'erg' of a person would be nearly impossible, what you can absorb is the life-force created by the erg. But all that would do is heal your character.
Though, if you claim the skill can absorb erg, it would mean they would be able to absorb a wall as well.
Secondly, while executing the skill, wasting 'erg' would either hurt the user, or physically remove a part of them(depending if you want erg of life force).

Which is why stealing/using erg or life-force, would not work.

Another thing: In Mabinogi, the soul has erg around it, and probably part of it.

Also: Adding on, it is confirmed that:
"Souls are automatically obtained from defeating enemies, including Barrier Spikes or other players through PvP."

Making Aura's the most accurate so far, but this doesn't mean it won't be changed. Keep in mind, this is just mechanics, and not necessarily translated to IC. I mean.. it does say we can take it from barrier spikes.

"Souls are not collected from enemies defeated by pets nor marionettes."
Though, it also means that our pets have no souls D=<

Bushin is NOT Doppleganger. They are two different skills, according to the wiki. Basically Dopple is a modified version of Bushin that we got in the NA.

On that note, I think it means through Elf vs Giant pvp, which I highly don't consider in an IC sense considering what happens in that.

And I found it odd that you can't charge the skill by killing with puppets. I went through the entirety of Their Method without getting a charge until the end when I started windmilling a few zombies. (Meaning Xeek translated it wrong.) It says that you can't get the soul from having a pet or puppet kill the enemy. Pet was kinda obvious though.

However, THIS is something I'd like to consider.

"Souls are collected from finishing blows, rather than killing blows. "

ICly, this means if you don't kill them kill them until they die, and just fatally wound them, they get their last words then die, should it count? You gave the killing blow, but not the finishing blow since they talked a bit before truely dieing.

So while Aura's seems most accurate, I still prefer the idea of having a Milletian soul not gatherable.

Glaceon wrote:Bushin is NOT Doppleganger. They are two different skills, according to the wiki. Basically Dopple is a modified version of Bushin that we got in the NA.

On that note, I think it means through Elf vs Giant pvp, which I highly don't consider in an IC sense considering what happens in that.

And I found it odd that you can't charge the skill by killing with puppets. I went through the entirety of Their Method without getting a charge until the end when I started windmilling a few zombies. (Meaning Xeek translated it wrong.) It says that you can't get the soul from having a pet or puppet kill the enemy. Pet was kinda obvious though.

That was my oops XD
I guess out pets do have souls... My main point stands though.
And they are basically the same skill with a few stat changes >_>

However, THIS is something I'd like to consider.

"Souls are collected from finishing blows, rather than killing blows. "

ICly, If you don't finish them off, and just fatally wound them, they get their last words then die, should it count? You gave the killing blow, but not the finishing blow since they talked a bit before truely dieing.

So while Aura's seems most accurate, I still prefer the idea of having a Milletian soul not gatherable.

I fixed your sentence >_> 'kill them until they die'?

Also: I always figured it worked that way, you have to deliver the finishing blow.

Needless to say, I'm fine with mine. But I'm also fine with Mithos' as well, the milletian soul not being grabbed(which, doesn't it make soul stones and soul destroying powers obsolete, if we're saying that there's no way to touch them without going up to soul stream?)



My question is, is this a requested 'soul power' or just as in game skill?

I'm fine with both as well. Although, it we go the "Milletian souls can't be grabbed" way, we could always add "without any special training/material" to explain Soul Stones and soul destroying powers

I'd say that if we go Aura's way, it should be a requested soul power since it can affect the respawn time. If Milletian souls have immunity to this skill through any other method, though, I'd say go the in-game skill route.

I think it's best to go with Mithos'. Adding onto the time someone cannot RP their character does not seem fair to give to the general public....or..to anyone..

er.. let me clarify. The 1 extra day thing wouldn't always happen. It's basically a safety to keep someone from holding on to a milletian's soul forever, so it couldn't be abuse-able. They would just have 1 day to use the skill, or the soul would automatically go back to the soul stream and the timer for re-spawn be set. Otherwise, it would be exactly like just killing a milletian anyway.

That's still being like

"I decide to kill you and just not use the soul just so you have to wait a day, hahaha"

Only if people are jerks, tbh. I personally don't see an extra day being a big deal, and only offered that as a unique penalty for dying by having the skill used on them.

But yeah, I'm fine with either Mithos' way or my own. And the extra condition to make the soul stones work, seems fine too.

Alright, any other suggestions?

Auramune wrote:
Only if people are jerks, tbh. I personally don't see an extra day being a big deal, and only offered that as a unique penalty for dying by having the skill used on them.

But yeah, I'm fine with either Mithos' way or my own. And the extra condition to make the soul stones work, seems fine too.

You don't use the skill on them when they die, though. The collection is automatic as long as you have the doppelganger skill, you don't need to actively collect the soul.



So, anyway, I like Mithos', I have no other suggestions, and I'll be making my own power request with the skill anyway so I don't matter~