Acanthus' General Abilities and spells.

Eranor Mon May 10, 2010 4:48 pm

I know im not in the guild, but I RP with you guys enough to have to do this.

As the former King of the Vampires (He is working to earn his title back) He has amassed a few spells, Vampires are essentially hunters, and are very stealthy, well most of them, so their abilities focus on paralyzing, disabling, and just putting things to sleep. Here is a list of the abilities he posesses.

Paralyze:
Acan can paralyze most humanoids with fear by just staring into their eyes. A general vampire trait.

Unconsciousness:
A kiss to the lips will render most humanoids unconscious. This is done by secreting a venom from the lips, to the lips of the victim. Much like those 'Goodnight kisses' female assassins used. Except Acan is male.

Sleep/Drowsiness:
He learnt a certain spell/song from a certain Siren, that will enable him to make Female/Male humanoids either get drowsy and sluggish, or put them to sleep entirely.

Bite of Death/Turning:
When a vampire feeds, normally the victim doesnt even know it has happened. They feed on sleeping people, however they can CHOOSE to turn them or to kill them. If the Vampire wants to turn them, it will release the disease into their bloodstream through their fangs. The victim will have 3 days to come up with a cure or they will turn. Death? Eh, just rip out their jugular vein. Kills most anyone. ((Life Drain usually works for Bite in a PvP battle))

Enchanced Sight: As a hunter, Vampires have nightvision, and enchanced sight. Meaning they can see further, and see through pitch black. A general vampire trait.

Enchanced Strength: As a hunter, Vampires have a very strong physique, required for their Enchanced Agility, and just to generally break down doors, and move heavy heavy things.

Enchanced Agility: A vampire is much like a cat in that it has extremely good balance. They are masters of "Free Running/Parkour" and use this ability to escape sight or arrest. It also means they can dodge a quick blade much easier then a regular human.

Enchanced Perception: Vampires are much more perceptive then regular humanoids in that they can usually sense a trap ie: Bear trap etc. They have a very strong instinct and usually follow it.

Hand-to-Hand combat: When Acan was travelling, he met a band of wandering martial artists. They taught him their ways and he is now quite adept at hand to hand fighting.

Enchanced Jump: They can jump 7x higher and further then a regular human. A vampire trait.

And that is all! Hope you think they arent GODmodding.

**Dalvar** Mon May 10, 2010 4:52 pm

Didn't we already have a thread for you...?

Honeko Mon May 10, 2010 4:53 pm

How do these fit within the already instated Mabinogi lore and how do they work using game mechanics?

Eranor Mon May 10, 2010 5:06 pm

Honeko wrote:How do these fit within the already instated Mabinogi lore and how do they work using game mechanics?

Vampires arent a part of Mabinogi Lore. IM yet to fight one anyway if they are.

Honeko Mon May 10, 2010 5:19 pm

Sorry I cannot approve anything that doesn't fit within Mabinogi lore.

The Kerrins Mon May 10, 2010 5:56 pm

I say we approve these, only to have him completely and utterly defeated by Yuurei anyway, who is then taken out in one shot by anyone else in the guild. A specialist is a specialist, after all.

Seriously though, at the least try to justify each ability using game mechanics.
example:The paralysis is short-term and short-range. Acan uses his high speed to get within range, but still must come close to the target for it to work, and can therefore be countered. mechanical representation:The Charge skill

or:Enhanced sight is simply represented by the fact that characters do not have their ranged of vision reduced at night.

Veleth Mon May 10, 2010 5:59 pm

*wonders how closely this one is tied to his last experience with Acan's superpowered beings*

I'm going to ask for how you represent the various statements you have made. Please provide us with how these things are represented IG. As well, how does one become a vampire if there are no such creatures in the world you are in?

How did you come to Erinn and remain a vampire?

Xenny Mon May 10, 2010 6:39 pm

-adjusts glasses-

Mmm let me give you all a crash course in Vampires. Succubi and Incubi are actually most widely accepted as a subclass of Vampires. So, yes. There are vampires in Mabinogi, they just go by different names. If we are to believe what the profiles and our members say, then we have quite a few Vampires in our guild. Also, if you're going to say 'If it doesn't exist in Mabi lore, it can't be here', then Soifa shouldn't have gotten her Alpness approved. Oh yeah, Alps would also be considered a sub-genre of vampires. Another thing is that many people consider Vampirism to be a trait of the soul rather than of the body, meaning it could be transferred to this world.

I'm not defending Acan, I'm defending vampires. :l

And, I agree with everyone else on that he should use these powers with IG Skills and context.

Kayeori Mon May 10, 2010 6:46 pm

Adding to what Xenny has said we do actually have something more similar. You say we don't have vampires in Mabi? I disagree. We have vampire bats in a few dungeons. If we have vampire bats then I'd say it is safe to assume they have infected a few humans, elves, giants, or fomors by now. However, as to the game mechanics used to describe these powers is a must. Obviously a few can skate by with the RP only tag, but there is most likely a game mechanic or two that can help you explain how you pull of some of these feats.

Honeko Mon May 10, 2010 7:09 pm

In my defense I cannot approve of anything that is not in Mabi lore. I did not say that vampires were not, as I can easily see the justification that they are similar to succubi and incubi as they are in Dresden-verse (Dresden Files - Jim Butcher GO READ IS GOOD)...

But also, if you are a milletian and used to be a vampire, you come here as a human as that is how Nao works. Just a thought.

Darian Mon May 10, 2010 7:15 pm

Dude, I *totally* just killed you. I mean . . . c'mon man. Seriously, though, if you want help figuring out powers vs. IG lore/coded skills, let me know. Still, this means that Liiam will have to step up his 'get rid of people forever' methods.

Also, vampires, while *not* strictly present in Mabi lore are a common figure in European lore as a whole. I mean, Mabi has werewolves, but they're French. While I don't think that incubi/succubi fall under the same category of monsters/demons, I think there's a precedent in enough people in the guild wanting to be something odd to at least consider adding vampires. And as to keeping vampires after getting a new body, well, that's simple: The most powerful vampires in most lore were those that were born vampires. If he's born that way, then of course it'd transfer over. Or we can blame Fenrir. It's his fault somehow.

Xenny Mon May 10, 2010 7:24 pm

Liiam, I think I love you.

And yes, let's blame Fenrir.

Veleth Mon May 10, 2010 7:25 pm

You can't be born a vampire if you are a Milletian, Liiam, and you cannot be born a vampire as an Erinn-born as it does not exist in Mabinogi lore. There's the same chance of being born an Erinn-born vampire as being an Erinn-born wookie or dwarf.

If Acan wants to play a guy who used to be a vampire and now is the equivalent of a lunatic, I've no issue at all. Smile

He can certainly go around biting people on the neck and trying to jump large distances only to get smacked around by the people he bites and wind up frequently injured.

Dellinger Mon May 10, 2010 8:22 pm

More importantly, I have an issue that I think would have been addressed if Acanthus had bothered to read his earlier attempt to pass a vampire through the guild powers forum. Let me comment on each of these in turn, since you have failed to read both the rules and the stickied post for the powers forum.

Paralyze: This is blatant god-modding, and will never be approved.

Unconsciousness: I'm not sure how I feel about this, but you just state that 'the race does this, so there.' That is not enough of an acceptable reason for me to approve of this.

Sleep/Drowsiness: Again, blatant god-modding against anyone who is Humanoid.

Bite of Death/Turning: Life drain with 'you are now my slave' or 'you die' abilities from a range? No. Especially since you state you'll use this in PvP and it has a range. No auto-hitting.

Enhanced Sight: This covers basic sight which is a mechanic.

Enhanced Strength: High strength = game mechanic. Doesn't need to be covered. It's just 'strength.'

Enchanced Agility: You're attempting to justify auto-escaping and almost auto-dodging? No.

Enchanced Perception: This is the equivalent of god-knowing. No.

Hand-to-Hand combat: Flavor thing.

Enchanced Jump: No opinion on this, however I would recommend against it.

Acanthus. I will request a couple of things from you. Do not state to us 'Hope you think they arent GODmodding' if you choose to not read the stickied post, the earlier replies to your vampire powers, and you choose to give yourself powers that are blatantly god-moddy. Before you think to either use these powers within the guild and before you edit these, you will go back, read rule #7, you will read the stickied post in regards to powers, and you will actually give us legitimate powers to judge.

As well, go back to your old post. You need to actually give yourself every single weakness of a vampire if you're going to attempt to be one, or I will always refuse this. You are not permitted to god-play a character, and your evidence of taking only the strengths and none of the weaknesses will not be approved.

As well, to the people who state 'Vamp is in mabi...' Please read up on what Succubi and Incubi actually are: They are demons who attempt to draw energy (not specified how) or attempt to (from the Incubus page) "lie upon sleepers, especially women, in order to have sexual intercourse with them." A vampire is similar, but it is not necessarily the same thing, especially if we're going to give Acan all of these buffs and give the normal individuals calling themselves Succubi or Incubi nothing in return. At the same time, in response to Kayeori, Vampire Bats are actually living creatures located to the Americas, normally spanning from Mexico to Brazil, Chile, and Argentina. These Vampire Bats are probably nothing more than just the creatures, so it is most likely the case that they never infected anyone since there is no 'infection' to begin with.

Thank you all who decided not to TL/DR this.

Darian Mon May 10, 2010 8:37 pm

Well, this actually brings up another issue. *Is* there any way to get to Erinn *without* being snapped up by Nao? I know that for most people the moment they died is the moment they get reborn. However, I've had it that Liiam got there through a elven waygate on his world that function similar to the mana tunnels in Iria. Now, obviously, he gets reborn and is also a Milletian, but this got me thinking. What methods exist for getting to Erinn and maybe the policy should be looked at? After all, restricting players to *just* Mabi Lore presents a lot of problems concerning creativity and expression. I certainly enjoy Celtic lore as much as the next person, but Mabi also has some Asian influence as well in Iria. Namely the pyramids and temples that surround the elves.

Introducing vampires is certainly a huge, potentially destructive change in policy, that much I firmly believe. Especially without the weaknesses of burning up on holy ground or in daylight. Perhaps a more codified understanding of what the policy regarding allowed characters are might be helpful. After all, in Mabi we have the Liche, zombies, ghosts, ghouls and other undead, none of which are strictly Irish in nature, so I understand why Acan believes it's appropriate. The Liche, I believe is German and Zombies are from Jamaica and Africa, so there is a precedent for non-Celtic creature archetypes. Again, I'm not saying to allow everything and make the guild a complete mess; I'm saying that a more codified policy is in order so we have a standing rule to point to and go 'Yep, that's okay' or 'No way, pal'.

Also, we should examine what's fair and what isn't. Disallowing a character archetype because it's 'not in the lore' is a perfectly acceptable argument, but we owe it to people to consider expanding the Mabi lore just a little. After all, we allow dragons transformed into human form when Mabi doesn't present that ability at all (to my knowledge).

As to Acan in particular, I'd ask him to adapt an existing monster to his char, for the time being at least. Perhaps a vampire who was reborn as an incubi and now has to deal with the different body functions such would entail but still retaining the 'not human' form that seems to be at the heart of this. Or, by a different approach. A former vampire (now human) who wants to *return* to his form and must follow a plot (perhaps laid out by staff) to recreate the original conditions of what caused vampirism in the first place. (That is just a suggestion on how to take what's 'broken' and turn it into a tool to further RP. I'm hoping to build on the idea of constructive debate that leads to a solution that pleases the vast majority.)

Eranor Mon May 10, 2010 9:19 pm

Alright, lemme think this out.. any ideas on what I can be or do then?

Eranor Mon May 10, 2010 9:20 pm

Dellinger wrote:More importantly, I have an issue that I think would have been addressed if Acanthus had bothered to read his earlier attempt to pass a vampire through the guild powers forum. Let me comment on each of these in turn, since you have failed to read both the rules and the stickied post for the powers forum.

Paralyze: This is blatant god-modding, and will never be approved.

Unconsciousness: I'm not sure how I feel about this, but you just state that 'the race does this, so there.' That is not enough of an acceptable reason for me to approve of this.

Sleep/Drowsiness: Again, blatant god-modding against anyone who is Humanoid.

Bite of Death/Turning: Life drain with 'you are now my slave' or 'you die' abilities from a range? No. Especially since you state you'll use this in PvP and it has a range. No auto-hitting.

Enhanced Sight: This covers basic sight which is a mechanic.

Enhanced Strength: High strength = game mechanic. Doesn't need to be covered. It's just 'strength.'

Enchanced Agility: You're attempting to justify auto-escaping and almost auto-dodging? No.

Enchanced Perception: This is the equivalent of god-knowing. No.

Hand-to-Hand combat: Flavor thing.

Enchanced Jump: No opinion on this, however I would recommend against it.

Acanthus. I will request a couple of things from you. Do not state to us 'Hope you think they arent GODmodding' if you choose to not read the stickied post, the earlier replies to your vampire powers, and you choose to give yourself powers that are blatantly god-moddy. Before you think to either use these powers within the guild and before you edit these, you will go back, read rule #7, you will read the stickied post in regards to powers, and you will actually give us legitimate powers to judge.

As well, go back to your old post. You need to actually give yourself every single weakness of a vampire if you're going to attempt to be one, or I will always refuse this. You are not permitted to god-play a character, and your evidence of taking only the strengths and none of the weaknesses will not be approved.

As well, to the people who state 'Vamp is in mabi...' Please read up on what Succubi and Incubi actually are: They are demons who attempt to draw energy (not specified how) or attempt to (from the Incubus page) "lie upon sleepers, especially women, in order to have sexual intercourse with them." A vampire is similar, but it is not necessarily the same thing, especially if we're going to give Acan all of these buffs and give the normal individuals calling themselves Succubi or Incubi nothing in return. At the same time, in response to Kayeori, Vampire Bats are actually living creatures located to the Americas, normally spanning from Mexico to Brazil, Chile, and Argentina. These Vampire Bats are probably nothing more than just the creatures, so it is most likely the case that they never infected anyone since there is no 'infection' to begin with.

Thank you all who decided not to TL/DR this.

Also, I've stated his weaknesses in one of his bio's somewhere.
Also, the Bite of Death/Turning, DOES NOT, have a range. Life drain just represents this. I didnt explain it properly. When I am close to somebody, like face-to-face then I am in range, its not like his teeth have range. And I ask BEFORE I turn. The use of life drain is done after I have RPed biting and feeding off someone. Though, admittadly, I dont see where I can use the life drain skill to represent the bite anyway.

Eranor Mon May 10, 2010 9:50 pm

On second thought I'll just ditch the supernatural thing and have him revert to what he originally was when he first came to Erinn? A viking explorer/Mysterious stranger (Mysterious stranger because of his weird-ass accent.) Is that better? Hell, it'll be easier to approve, no doubt. No mystical powers and what not. Not yet at least.

**Temo** Mon May 10, 2010 10:41 pm

Mmkay, guess I'll give my input after seeing all this. What I'm gonna suggest is rather than vampire, make Acan an incubus. Aside from methods in how they go about their diet, they're the almost the same thing if not THE same thing due to how mythology and cultures like to twist things. On top of that, people also forget that there's tricks folks may have used to make illusions of myth a reality, which may also be applied here if you can think of a way to do so. As for my take on the powers and advice on 'em:

Paralyze: What Dell said. This one I can't in good conscience allow, sorry. Besides, if this were true, you wouldn't have been able to carry out interactions in the manner you have been to begin with. Embarassed

Unconsciousness: I would consider changing this to a skill rather than a racial ability. Erinn has plenty herbs and venoms; and making potions or poisons is no big thing. Any shmuck with a potion creation kit can make something. That said, it's perfectly fine to apply something to the lips to use for the same affect given here - just be careful not to lick them and put yourself out. silent

Could be integrated through use of poison vials though it's more of a roleplayed and consent thing as well. I can allow this if it's changed up.

Sleep/Drowsiness: Need some clarification on this before I can make a decision - like how it's performed and how you intend to integrate it with in-game mechanics.

Bite of Death/Turning: You've explained this and I can accept it as far as its use. However the turning bit - methinks that needs to go, if switching to the 'cubi angle of things anyway. I don't think succubi or incubi are capable of turning others.

Enhanced Sight: Just simple in-game sight with widened range, which can be adjusted through Options. Nothing special and nothing necessary for this to be listed here.

Enhanced Strength: As Dell said, "High strength = game mechanic". Build up your character's strength and there you go. Razz

Enhanced Agility: I can see this working with Final Hit, but that's about it. Problem with FH is it takes time to activate and blatantly obvious when used. However, if attempting this from a roleplay standpoint, it could be an adrenaline rush thing. Temporary boost of speed for a few seconds - maybe something used to get in and out quick or dispatch of something in timely fashion - and revert to normal afterward/weakened state until fully charged again.

Enchanced Perception: Roleplay skill based on your character's knowledge and smarts. This is not an excuse to meta-game. Keep that in mind. However, I would advise against this one. It's one thing to play a smart and perceptive character, but it's another to end up with a know-it-all. We had one person like that already and it didn't end well for him. Rolling Eyes

Hand-to-Hand combat: That's all on you and your skills as an RPer and PVPer. Razz

Enchanced Jump: Only way I can see this being used is as an escape option, via goddess wing.

Frankly, I don't find this to be a bad list. You just needed to put more thought into a few things and maybe not rely so much on vampirism for others. Unless you're giving up, keep at it.

And as for everybody else (and you know who you are), please keep things more constructive/helpful and less...offensive/attacking/bashing/whatever you wanna call it. Second time within a week, yeesh. Neutral

Captincrunch Mon May 10, 2010 10:46 pm

Just a clarification on the death becomes them bit for Milletians and back stories in general.
Mose but not all have entered directly through the soul stream or have been born here and entered the soul stream.
There are a few exceptions according to character histories and backgrounds but maybe a handful at most and one I know is a villain.

......................

I always like the original Viking and as far as I know there has been maybe one or two more at most since.
Besides Vampires are a pain in the neck (just watched the Southpark Vampire / Goth feud episode )

**Temo** Mon May 10, 2010 10:49 pm

Captincrunch wrote:Just a clarification on the death becomes them bit for Milletians and back stories in general.
Mose but not all have entered directly through the soul stream or have been born here and entered the soul stream.
There are a few exceptions according to character histories and backgrounds but maybe a handful at most and one I know is a villain.

Good sir, I have no idea what you're talking about. farao

Eranor Tue May 11, 2010 5:41 am

Temo wrote:Mmkay, guess I'll give my input after seeing all this. What I'm gonna suggest is rather than vampire, make Acan an incubus. Aside from methods in how they go about their diet, they're the almost the same thing if not THE same thing due to how mythology and cultures like to twist things. On top of that, people also forget that there's tricks folks may have used to make illusions of myth a reality, which may also be applied here if you can think of a way to do so. As for my take on the powers and advice on 'em:

Paralyze: What Dell said. This one I can't in good conscience allow, sorry. Besides, if this were true, you wouldn't have been able to carry out interactions in the manner you have been to begin with.

Unconsciousness: I would consider changing this to a skill rather than a racial ability. Erinn has plenty herbs and venoms; and making potions or poisons is no big thing. Any shmuck with a potion creation kit can make something. That said, it's perfectly fine to apply something to the lips to use for the same affect given here - just be careful not to lick them and put yourself out. Could be integrated through use of poison vials though it's more of a roleplayed and consent thing as well. I can allow this if it's changed up.

Sleep/Drowsiness: Need some clarification on this before I can make a decision - like how it's performed and how you intend to integrate it with in-game mechanics.

Bite of Death/Turning: You've explained this and I can accept it as far as its use. However the turning bit - methinks that needs to go, if switching to the 'cubi angle of things anyway. I don't think succubi or incubi are capable of turning others.

Enhanced Sight: Just simple in-game sight with widened range, which can be adjusted through Options. Nothing special and nothing necessary for this to be listed here.

Enhanced Strength: As Dell said, "High strength = game mechanic". Build up your character's strength and there you go.

Enhanced Agility: I can see this working with Final Hit, but that's about it. Problem with FH is it takes time to activate and blatantly obvious when used. However, if attempting this from a roleplay standpoint, it could be an adrenaline rush thing. Temporary boost of speed for a few seconds - maybe something used to get in and out quick or dispatch of something in timely fashion - and revert to normal afterward/weakened state until fully charged again.

Enchanced Perception: Roleplay skill based on your character's knowledge and smarts. This is not an excuse to meta-game. Keep that in mind. However, I would advise against this one. It's one thing to play a smart and perceptive character, but it's another to end up with a know-it-all. We had one person like that already and it didn't end well for him.

Hand-to-Hand combat: That's all on you and your skills as an RPer and PVPer.

Enchanced Jump: Only way I can see this being used is as an escape option, via goddess wing.

Frankly, I don't find this to be a bad list. You just needed to put more thought into a few things and maybe not rely so much on vampirism for others. Unless you're giving up, keep at it.

And as for everybody else (and you know who you are), please keep things more constructive/helpful and less...offensive/attacking/bashing/whatever you wanna call it. Second time within a week, yeesh.

Ill think out some more practical ways to apply some of those powers if I decide to return as an Incubi, with Enchanced Agility, I meant it as more of a balance thing for example, used in a rooftop chase perhaps, like a solid footing. He is still susceptible to falling and biting the ground , but it is less likely to happen.I'll of course drop the powers and spells that do NOT apply to incubi. And Ill get rid of the whole paralyzation thing.. However, I may choose to just return as original Acan, except without the creepy tone in his voice. More of a Scandanavian vibe happening.

Eranor Tue May 11, 2010 5:50 am

Dellinger wrote:More importantly, I have an issue that I think would have been addressed if Acanthus had bothered to read his earlier attempt to pass a vampire through the guild powers forum. Let me comment on each of these in turn, since you have failed to read both the rules and the stickied post for the powers forum.

Bite of Death/Turning: Life drain with 'you are now my slave' or 'you die' abilities from a range? No. Especially since you state you'll use this in PvP and it has a range. No auto-hitting.

Here's the thing. With the bite of turning, I DID NOT turn anybody against their will ICly. I always asked first. It was just another Roleplay path if somebody chose to take it. Much akin to receiving the Dark Gift if any of you have played Oblivion.

Dellinger Tue May 11, 2010 7:01 am

Acan wrote:
Dellinger wrote:Bite of Death/Turning: Life drain with 'you are now my slave' or 'you die' abilities from a range? No. Especially since you state you'll use this in PvP and it has a range. No auto-hitting.

Here's the thing. With the bite of turning, I DID NOT turn anybody against their will ICly. I always asked first. It was just another Roleplay path if somebody chose to take it. Much akin to receiving the Dark Gift if any of you have played Oblivion.

It doesn't really matter if you have specifically never done it. What matters is that you're giving yourself the ability to potentially violate what has already been said about powers in regards to god-modding. It is nothing personal, considering I would disapprove anyone who attempted to pass an ability that was worded in such a way that could possibly justify the use of this ability in a god-moddish sort of way. The ability itself is the problem, not your ability to control it.

However, if you are going down the Incubus route, I believe this point will be moot, considering Incubi mess with their victims in different ways than vampires (look specifically for what they are known for / rumored to do). Please read up on the subject before editing your powers. That, or get in touch with a resident incubus (names escape me at the moment) and figure out what has already been put into place. There are already incubi characters in the guild, so it would seem best to figure out what's already up in that department.

Eranor Tue May 11, 2010 5:25 pm

Understood

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